Unit Attack Speed

[ThreeTigerSilverWind]

How can I maximize a unit's attack speed -- would it be to set the Animation Rate (under Projectiles) to zero or near zero and set its attack rate (under Monsters) to a negative number like -10?

Is there something else I can do to make the unit (e.g. Heron Guard) attack faster?

Thanks in advance.

[Pyro]

You can alter the recovery time the unit's attacks use. The recovery time makes the units pause before they attack again. Also, if the sequence the unit uses for that attack has a lot of frames, then it will take longer to attack right away. But you won't need to alter this, since it sounds like you just want a shorter recovery time found in each attack.

[ThreeTigerSilverWind]

Sorry, by "attack rate (under Monsters)" I meant "recovery time."

I set my Heron Guard unit's animation rate very close to zero and his recovery time to -7.000 -- is there anything else I can do to make it attack faster?

For example, has anyone ever tried setting the animation rate to a negative number?

Thanks.

[Pyro]

Maybe a better question would be, what are you trying to do? Why would you want a lower recovery time?

[ThreeTigerSilverWind]

The reason is simple really: I like to mess around with maps and units and push the limits in certain areas. For me, it would be nice to have a melee Hero unit that has a lightning-fast attack speed. Some may say a -7.000 recovery time is fast enough, but I am seeking to push the limit in this area and set it to the maximum level that Myth will allow. Setting the recovery rate at -10.000 doesn't seem to make a noticeable difference, neither does lowering the animation rate in conjunction with setting the speed at -10.000 (though I have not yet tried setting the animation rate to a negative number -- won't have access to Myth for a few days and, unfortunately, can't test this right now).

If you know of a way to adjust a unit's attack rate other than through those two variables, and can let me know, that would be much appreciated.

Thanks.

[Pyro]

I already have.... the less the frames a sequence uses... the faster the attack will go. If you make it the fastest melee attack possible, wouldn't it stop being a melee attack? Just take a look at The Deceiver, his attack sequence loops so it goes faster than any melee attack.

[ThreeTigerSilverWind]

If that is the only way, then that is too bad. I don't have the means to edit Collections.

Instead of removing sequences, I would prefer to speed them up, e.g, to replicate the attack/animation speed one would see when playing the game at 2x Game Speed. But if that is not possible, then oh well.

[Pyro]

I didn't say removing sequences, I said removing frames from the attack sequence. For example, the heron guard has 2 attack sequences. One with one sword swing and the other with both. Each has 5 frames. A frame is a set of images used by the sequence. So in the first frame the heron has the swords up. The next two frames the heron is moving the swords more and more back, setting up his swing. The fourth frame the heron is swinging and the last frame the swords are down to its lowest point of the swing.

Removing frames isn't the only way, you can even change the number of ticks it takes per frame to play out the sequence. Those 2 attack sequences have 2 ticks per frame. So that means it takes 10 ticks to play out each of those 2 sequences. Keep in mind 30 ticks is one second.

[Deqlyn]

The deceiver has -2.00 recovery time and his attack has 1000 repitions before it stops attacking unless the unit dies. Might be able just to add repitions but I think you need to leave the animation limit and just use recovery time depending on how fast u want it.

[ThreeTigerSilverWind]

Thanks for the info.

Pyro -- how do I change the number of ticks per frame? If you could direct me to the application (if there is one), that would be great.

Thanks.

[Pyro]

You need a collection editor to do that. You can use Amber which is a Mac OS classic program. There is Tahoe which is a more limited collection editor for PC. There is also Oak which is cross-platform but is currently still being made.

[Renwood]

Yea at a certain point you cant speed up a units melee attack any more.

the real limit is the number of frames in the attack animation. so a guy with 1 or 2 frames for an attack animated as fast as fear can make it is the limit.

hope that makes sense

[ThreeTigerSilverWind]

Yeah.
So, it looks like I will need a Collections editor either to remove frames from sequences or change the number of ticks. Would prefer the latter.

I have a PC and tried editing with Tahoe, but did not get very far. Is Tahoe capable of performing either of the two options above?

If not, any word on when Oak will be available?

Thanks.

[Pyro]

I still think the reason for wanting this is crazy but here you go. Download this file. It is a zip with a modified heron guard collection that has attack1 and attack2 use 1 tick per frame instead of the default 2.

And no, Tahoe is not capable of that. You could either wait for Oak or even run SheepShaver. Which is a Mac OS classic emulator for windows. With that then you can use Amber.

[ThreeTigerSilverWind]

Pyro! Thanks very much!!!

This is great -- can't wait to test it out. Now my uber Heron Guard unit may actually deserve its uber title (I call him the "Heron Guard Captain").

I am also looking into getting a cheap Mac Classic OS to use with Sheepshaver and Amber. In Project Magma's "Requiem of the Dead" and Mazz VI, there is a highly-detailed version of the Heron Guard and I wanted to edit those guys too.

Is there any way I can convince you to edit the collection for the highly-detailed herons as well?

Thanks again.