Editing a tagset?

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Editing a tagset?

Postby Hicks » Thu Feb 01, 2018 11:36 am

I'm not sure how to go about this or where to ask.

I'm curious if it is possible to (and how to) tweak an HD overhaul pack for Myth 2 (Myth HD Total Conversion v1.31) to either remove or replace the fire and explosion effects with the game's original effects.

Thanks in advance.
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Re: Editing a tagset?

Postby Point » Fri Feb 02, 2018 10:50 am

a few tagsets already have done this... though if you want to try again the easiest way is to extract the graphics collections aka tags with a program called OAK then replace the lower resolution graphics with higher resolution graphics... and then adjust the scale of the OBJECT in the tools program FEAR so the size of the fire is correct in game.


Souly's new n tasty myth beta replaces most effects and I believe Renwoods HD tagset replaces them all as well.

what still is needed is a tagset that replaces all the myth tags with higher resolution set up so people with the demo version of myth can play all maps and mods.

have fun.
Play more Flashpoint Play more Myth then go live some life
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Re: Editing a tagset?

Postby Hicks » Fri Feb 02, 2018 11:15 am

Wonderful thank you!

I'll have an experiment with the tools and see if I can make the changes I am hoping to.

I only ever tinkered with the level design tools for Myth 2 about fifteen years ago so this is a pretty blank slate for me.
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Re: Editing a tagset?

Postby Point » Fri Feb 02, 2018 12:27 pm

Play more Flashpoint Play more Myth then go live some life
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Re: Editing a tagset?

Postby Filorarynut » Sat Feb 03, 2018 12:01 am

I would also like to know whether to fix it or not. I really want to know.
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Re: Editing a tagset?

Postby Hicks » Sat Feb 03, 2018 7:08 am

I've poked around a little with tools, really nice interface!

I think it would be possible to extract the original fire fx textures and then unpack and replace the modified packs version with them. It'll take some more poking and prodding to find out how to do so but it looks like it will be possible.
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Re: Editing a tagset?

Postby Point » Sat Feb 03, 2018 11:24 am

this is a big download though the fire is redone in this mod fairly well... > http://tain.totalcodex.net/items/show/m ... ublic-beta

it maybe animates a bit to fast though good graphics
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Re: Editing a tagset?

Postby Hicks » Sat Feb 03, 2018 3:55 pm

Looks interesting! I've still to really play through Myth 3 as well. I've tried five or six times now to download that file but at most reaching 1.2gb then it fails.
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Re: Editing a tagset?

Postby Pyro » Sat Feb 03, 2018 4:58 pm

Hicks wrote:I've tried five or six times now to download that file but at most reaching 1.2gb then it fails.


Go to this thread and use the alternate link to get it. Worked for me.

As for the tagset stuff. You will also need Fear, which is installed using the latest Myth2 update if you check the mapmaking tools option. The tools haven't been updated since 1.8.0, but all (non-beta) updates come with the tools. Oak (linked by Point, does not come with the update) already does a lot of what Fear does and other things, but a few options are still only in Fear. It may help to look at how those default tags are interconnected before altering those from a tagset. When working with the tools, it can get messy. So it may help to make a duplicate Myth II folder or more. You can take out all the 3rd party plugins from the duplicate folder as you just need the default stuff to work. If unsure, you can always just make a new Myth2 folder, copy over the "tags" subfolder, and run the latest (non-beta) update on that new Myth2 folder.

(Note for Fear: If you open a tag and do not intend to change it, do not press OK. Press Cancel every time to close. Otherwise you "saved" the tag into your local folder.)

Anything with an image will have a "collection" tag. Collection tags are a collection of images. Depending on the effect you wish to change, it may have one of or a mixture of these tag types: "projectile", "projectile group", "local projectile groups". Other tags will be connected to these such as "collections", "objects", and "local physics".

Since you want to change the images used for explosions, let's use the dwarf bottle attack as an example. You can use Loathing (a tool that comes with the updates) to see what unit types a map has as there could be multiple units that look the same but are different. Double clicking on the unit tool will give you a list of unit types on the map.

So now you see that "dwarf" is the unit you wish to examine. In Fear you open the "dwarf" unit tag. You see it uses the "dwarf" monster tag. In some cases monster and unit tags will have the same name, but not always. So it never hurts to take this long way rather than guess, specially if this is new to you. Now go to the monster tag for "dwarf". Look at the attacks listed. You will see "dwarf bottle lit". Go look for that projectile tag. From there you see what the projectile will detonate into. In this case to a projectile group tag "dwarf bottle explosion". Load that projectile group. In it you will see a few projectile tags listed. In this case, the one you may be after is "dwarf bottle fireball". If you double click on it, you see the tag will produce 5 to 6 of them on detonation. Now go find that projectile tag. You will see what collection it uses, in this case "dwarf" and the sequence is "Fireball".

Now that you know how it all is connected, you can look into the tags of the tagset you wish to edit. Perhaps you have it in a different Myth folder in case the mapmaker replaced the default tags rather than made new ones. In that case you won't find the default tags and would lose a lot of time looking for what has been overwritten. Fear only works with default tags and what is in your local folder. Oak can load up plugins. One way to go about all this is using Oak to load that tagset, find that "dwarf bottle explosion" projectile group tag. Then edit it to replace the version of the explosion effect with the default one being "dwarf bottle fireball". If you can't find this tag with Oak, it means the tagset must have reused that tag. In that case, deactivate the tagset in Oak. Find the original tag and right click save to local. Now load back the tagset. Check to see if everything in the tags looks correct. It must have the default object and collection tags. If the mapmaker altered those as well, well more work for you to revert that back to default without breaking the tagset. If the tagset does not have these tags in them, you are good to go.

If want to work in Fear rather than Oak, you would need to disassemble the tagset suing Oak. Right click disassemble, but make sure to have a local folder that is empty or you will overwrite what you already have (if that matters). You can test your work in solo or in TCP/IP games. When you go on the metaserver, Myth tries to ignore most of your local. You use Fear to create the plugin once you are ready. After that, delete the local or rename it in case you want to work on it later. It may be possible to create a tagset for a tagset, but it depends on the original settings. Would require some trial and error to know for sure. If not, then you may need to recreate the tagset to include you changes. In that case, you need the rest of the tags in the local and not just loaded into Oak. You won't be able to play with others that do not have your plugin if you have it loaded into a game you are playing.

If Myth was running when you made a change with one of the tools, restart Myth. If you load a map and it crashes to main menu. Check your "myth_log" txt file. It will give you a report of errors there. Usually it means you are missing a tag that is not loaded. This could happen if you saved a tag from the tagset but tried to run it without the tagset loaded.
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Re: Editing a tagset?

Postby Hicks » Sun Feb 04, 2018 8:05 am

Thank you. I'll have an experiment soon.
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